One issue unaddressed by the New NYRA board members--once they understood that they themselves were not considered corporate officers and therefore would not be prohibited from wagering--was why shouldn't the new CEO, whoever that might be, be a horseplayer?
As good a start as David Skorton made in his debut as Chairman of the Board the New NYRA, the suspension of executive wagering privileges sends a sorry message to NYRA customers: The NYRA Board wants horseplayers’ business but they don’t want their executives engaging in the consumption of the product which might otherwise enhance their understanding of customer issues.
As a horseplayer advocate, I resent any restrictions on any horseplayer’s ability to participate in the greatest gambling game known to man, whether it prevents one making a bet in the privacy of one’s home due to State laws prohibiting Internet betting or in a CEO’s office due to a misguided mischaracterization of what it means to be a horseplayer.
Don’t misunderstand: Not all employees should be allowed to bet. The Drexel Frat Boys, for instance, permanently eliminated workers with totalizator access. Mutuel clerks shouldn’t be able to bet on credit or evade taxes as they once did at NYRA either.
There is a practical solution to this issue, however, which is simply to require all NYRA employees permitted to bet to do so through NYRA Rewards accounts, thereby subjecting them to the same scrutiny as their customers. Indeed, the opportunity and capacity to partake of the product via wagering should help NYRA executives understand and improve it.
I’m sure Churchill Downs thinks they improved their product by offering the Twinspires Player’s Pool which allows their customers to collectively conquer a Pick Six, even if they can’t brag about either their own handicapping skills or the return on their investment.
Indeed, on the day after Pearl Harbor day this year, the Aqueduct Pick Six carryover pool was attacked by a an undisclosed number of bettors -- each contributing whatever he/she was comfortable with -- toward the $21,704 total wagered on their behalf. (The actual tickets and a payout breakdown are available here)
The good news was that they took down the entire 6 of 6 winner’s share of $259,488 plus 71 5-of-6 consolations worth $169 each for a total payout of $271,487 and a gross profit of $249,783.
The better news was that everybody will be assessed only their fair and legal share of taxes on their respective winnings. There will be no "ten-percenter’s" services required, as was recently
described there.
The not-so-good news, however, was that after a 25% tax of $21,623.50 was withheld from each 6 of 6 ticket, the net profit was $206,616.50. Each Player’s Pool “share ”paid $95.19 for each $10 wagered, in effect odds of 8.5-1 odds. (One might assume that participants eligible for cash rewards/rebates did slightly better).
The bad news is that only three handicappers were privileged to have their participation paid for. If any CDI employee, including any of the three accomplished handicappers profited from an investment in that pool, directly or indirectly, then perhaps this ethically dubious situation is just what Skorton had in mind.
The worst news for the winners is that without the ability to form partnerships that legally distribute tax liability, law-abiding players, who share payouts requiring IRS form-signing in order to cash out, must find a way to balance each other’s liabilities. (This is especially difficult if only some, but not all, are subject to state income taxes that don’t allow gambling losses to be deducted from gambling winnings).
There is a larger ethical conflict here, to wit: Was an even larger carryover prevented due to a corporate bet-taker’s creation that gives it an unfair edge over the competition, which not only works against the best interests of competing bet-takers’ customers participating in that pool but also that of the host track that might have lost had the additional handle that might have chased that pool on site?
It’s my understanding that, perhaps for that reason, the Player’s Pool is not permitted to operate on California races.
According to Brisnet, ’access to the insights of its own expert handicappers, a huge bankroll, and a little bit of luck, makes the TwinSpires.com Player's Pool a must play. "I can't wait to help TwinSpires.com players take down another Pick 6,"’ said one executive.
But what happens when the Player’s Pool, having a big advantage over serious individual players, isn’t as profitable? It could result in a windfall for the successful competition. The more common result, however, is it likely will lower the rate of return to its own syndicate members because fewer participants will diminish economic leverage.
Larger questions remain: How did this result stack up against prior plays? Should prospective participants be privy to the Player’s Pool’s long-term performance? Do customers have access to those historical results? , but I was unable to locate, My own Google search failed to locate any summary of how the Player’s Pool has performed over time.
Of course, any player, betting anywhere, should be able to form an ad hoc partnership with any combination of other players with each individual taxed only on his/her designated fair share. After all, if such a pool is allowed at one ADW it should be allowed at all without restriction.
Unfortunately the Federal tax code remains unfair. Withholding status is still not determined by the gross profit instead of the cost of a single combination. Now it appears that “Fiscal Cliff” negotiations could negatively impact a horseplayers’ ability to deduct gambling losses against winnings on his Federal return. The NTRA is on that case.
Obviously, technology already exists to support what should be considered an enhancement to the social aspect of racing, which would by extension make small bankroll players more competitive with whales in exotic pools. Now is the perfect time for a grass-roots movement that bonds individuals together to better compete with whales of any stripe.



18 Dec 2012 at 05:22 pm | #
I,
According to Chairman Skorton, the New NYRA President/CEO is considered a de facto employee of New York State and allowing that person to bet would be in conflict. Further, he said that he didn’t want any executive distracted from doing his job: concentrating on serving the public.
18 Dec 2012 at 06:09 pm | #
Not knowledgeable about the inner workings of the horse racing legislature, thank God, but as someone who wants to keep the game clean, would have to insist that anyone judging the outcome of a race (stewards)not be allowed to wager on the races he is judging, and furthermore, anyone involved in the process of hiring said stewards not be allowed to wager on any races being judged by said stewards. To ban individuals from betting on other races around the country is ridiculous, and can only negatively affect my bottomline, as it has been my experience that these people are morons, based on their business decisions thus far, and most probably would make them perennial losers at the window. As long as their is no conflict, take their money with a smile, a big one.
TTT
19 Dec 2012 at 02:49 am | #
JP,
What has racing come to when someone putting on the show can’t have a bet on a horse attempting to win the Triple Crown right in front of them?
If they’re going to imply the inept were corrupt, then they’d better get that IG report out there to back them up!
Can the New NYRA CEO own a racehorse?
19 Dec 2012 at 03:34 pm | #
Although Charley Hayward obviously had his faults, the main fault being hubris, one thing in his favor was that he was a player. He obviously loved playing the horses, and was a knowledgeable handicapper. Ms. McLain, on the other hand, probably has never placed a bet in her life, which, in my opinion, is a mark against her to be the CEO of an organization such as NYRA. Hayward knew the problems horse players face every day. Why he chose to defraud the public out of $8 million dollars is an absolute mystery to me, other than the previously mentioned hubris.
19 Dec 2012 at 08:43 pm | #
I, good question re CEO and horse ownership, will find out.
19 Dec 2012 at 09:49 pm | #
I have thought about it, but I simply cannot comprehend how banning NYRA executives from wagering on the ponies or owning thoroughbreds has anything to do with slowing the decline in popularity of Thoroughbred racing in this country.
I also wonder if the new Chairman, Mr. Skorton, has ever bet on a horse, or actually knows without using a GPS where Belmont or Aqueduct are located.
I’m sure these issues, banning, betting, and owning are of great interest to Joe and Jane, trying to decide if they are going to the casino or the racetrack tomorrow.
20 Dec 2012 at 03:27 am | #
Would Jane and Joe decide any differently if they knew the New NYRA CEO couldn’t play slots, or buy a lottery ticket either? I assume he can still call his stock broker on his coffee break without being distracted from serving the public.
The effect of “Thou shalt not bet” is to demean both the product and the customer because it infers that anyone who gambles does or will do so compulsively. Exactly where is this revival of Puritanism and suspicion of pleasure coming from … Cuomo, Liebman, Skorton, all the preceding?
20 Dec 2012 at 03:26 pm | #
Indulto,
This is one on which we disagree.
You said, “The effect of “Thou shalt not bet” is to demean both the product and the customer because it infers that anyone who gambles does or will do so compulsively.”
I don’t believe the rule has anything to do with that. Rather, it was imposed because NYRA is now a quasi-public agency.
Allowing top NYRA officers to bet creates the suspicion that their official actions could be influenced by the desire to cash winning tickets. Rather than “compulsion” the concern is good old-fashioned greed.
For example, there has been at least one instance, of which I’m aware, when there were (unproven) suspicions a track superintendent was cooking the dirt surface in a manner which helped or hindered certain running styles. If said individual was prohibited from betting no such doubt would likely have been raised.
Perhaps the prohibition should not have been a blanket ban, but allowed them to wager on racing at other venues. By the way, I don’t believe any such prohibition is applied to Off-Track Betting officers in NY, which begs the question why not.
In my opinion, the NYRA Board should also have applied the same prohibition to Board members wagering on NYRA races. This is a clear conflict of interest with the public good.
Nor do I believe the notion that prohibiting wagers from NYRA officials diminishes their understanding of patron issues. Most, if not all, have experience with betting and customer service issues and a ban while in office doesn’t change that.
20 Dec 2012 at 03:30 pm | #
Please note:
My comment “there were (unproven) suspicions a track superintendent was cooking the dirt surface...” should in NO WAY be interpreted to suggest I was commenting on current or past NYRA employees, or that such an event occurred in NY or any specific racing venue.
20 Dec 2012 at 04:47 pm | #
NK,
Intent and effect are two different things, and the over-reaching greed feared is by nature compulsive. Why else would someone jeopardize his career in such fashion? I would not expect a ban to stop such behavior, but instead drive it underground where it will be even harder to catch.
Do you know of cases where NYRA and/or OTB executives or board members were in fact derelict in their duty due to their gambling activity? Were they allowed to go on working once that situation came to light?
The ban is worthless without enforcement which must continue to exist except that now trust will be absent from the work environment for everyone. What will have been accomplished? With or without a ban, bad apples have to be discovered and replaced.
The type of betting that should be banned is rebated betting masked by takeout rates that are too high.
Wasn’t it Reagan who popularized “Trust, but verify.”
20 Dec 2012 at 07:11 pm | #
NK, since we share the same space, I heard the same rumors you did re a past NYRA track super “cooking” the track.
Virtually un-"provable" the rumors came from too many sources not to have some fire behind the smoke, and I once witessed said super at the betting windows.
Racing office personnel, and paddock and patrol judges, are forbidden to wager, so why not CEOs and COOs? So why not eliminate the opportunity for potential impropriety?
WMC, apparently you do not keep pace with everything that’s written here, which is unimportant. But it had been pointed out that Mr. Skorton never saw a horse race in person, which doesn’t mean he cannot direct his advisors to implement ideas that would make the new NYRA more successful.
As the saying goes, you need not be Willie Sutton to recognize a bank robbery when you see one.
20 Dec 2012 at 09:30 pm | #
I want to reiterate my original comment should not be interpreted to apply to any former or current NYRA employees.
20 Dec 2012 at 10:38 pm | #
Mr. Pricci: Hell, why shouldn’t I be the CEO of the NYSE, the head of Citi Corp, the CEO of Churchill Downs, et cetera? Geez, it ‘doesn’t mean he cannot direct his advisors to implement ideas that would make X successful’.
Being qualified for a position is no longer relevant, apparently.
21 Dec 2012 at 02:48 am | #
Indulto - the Player’s Pool P-6 began with Charlie Ruma’s ADW America Tab. I fought this illegal wager into CA P-6 pools back in 2002 for over a year.
I spent the first year battling ORC (Oregon Racing Commission)which turned out to be a waste of time.
The Oregonian’s John Canzano ran a front page story
on the dispute in 2003 as I recall. The Oregon ADW laws were quite similiar to CA ADW laws which made the “partnership” illegal because an account holder could only represent a single entity/person.
The Oregon AG said in the article they would rule on the legality of the Player’s Pool P-6 but never did because America Tab and TVG were the 2 biggest ADW companies doing business in Oregon.If the AG made a ruling....he had to stop the illegal bets but no decision = business as usual. TVG reps in Oregon were contacted for this article and were asked why they don’t have a similiar partnership P-6 bet....their response,"because it’s illegal.”
I then took the fight to CA the next year because that’s where the bets from the Oregon hub were frequently winding up with big CA P-6 Carryover’s and at times they had P-6 bets as much as $50,000.I cited the same ADW rules/laws to make the argument to the CHRB as I did with ORC insisting the Player’s Pool P-6 was an illegal ADW wager.The CHRB Executive Director sent the complaint to the CA Attorney General’s Office and 2 weeks later… notified the CHRB to send a cease and desist order to the ORC regarding the Player’s Pool P-6 bet...it was an illegal ADW wager. I believe that was 2005.
I believe in 2007 Charlie Ruma sold several of his ADW companies to Churchill Downs which included Amercia Tab so that’s how Twinspires wound up with the Player’s Pool P-6. I researched KY ADW laws and again ...quite similiar to Oregon and California. I contacted the KY Commission and got nowhere then KY AG Office and they asked for more information. I gave KY AG Office all the information including the rule/laws the Player’s Pool P-6 wager were breaking but never heard back.
I did the same with NY AG Office about 5 years ago.....no response. The bottomline....the ONLY reason Twinspires can make Player’s Pool P-6 bets in KY and NY is because it hasn’t been challenged by those Racing Commissions and those states Attorney General Offices fail to issue a Ruling on the legality of the problematic ADW partnership P-6 wager.
They simply can’t cite a legal counter on the several ADW rules/laws that are being broken so they quietly disappear.
One of the negative impacts with that type of ADW P-6 partnership large wager.....the destruction of the consolation pools with 5 winners because in some instances they have over 50 -60 consolations which hammers the payout lower which negatively affects other horseplayers....big and small.
Charlie Ruma used the argument that they were only doing what they do at any track....getting people together to “pool” money for a big P-6 ticket. Yes, that’s true to a certain degree...the track may get less than 10 people together vs hundreds/thousands at America Tab ADW site which is now Twinspire Player’s Pool P-6. The problem that Charlie or even Bob Evans at CDI today can’t escape....at the racetrack there are no rules/laws prohibiting that but there are specific ADW laws that make that partnership illegal.
I would hope in the future there continues to be some advantages of going to the host track or satellite facility vs ADW play and this is just one example.
21 Dec 2012 at 01:30 pm | #
Roger,
Thanks for weighing in with that history.
It sounds as if you were in racetrack management at the time. If so, were you allowed to bet? Either way, what do you think of NYRA’s prohibition of wagering by executives?
It seems to me that exotic wager pools would swell if people could play in partnership with friends and/or others with like-minded selections.
I think of Player’s Pools as being most valuable and attractive as an alternative to one-armed bandits. No handicapping is necessary nor ticket structuring. Rather than sit at VLTs, one can leisurely watch one’s multiple-race play unfold—confident of at least a partial return for one’s time and money invested while being entertained.
Imagine a league of virtual whales representing teams of selectors competing on the basis of overall profit for a season-ending playoff between the top two. Each would be sufficiently funded to ensure some payout to their ad hoc investors. Teams with better records would undoubtedly become fully funded first, but the remainder would all fill as well. Eventually share size as well as number might have to be limited to ensure everybody who wanted to participate got to play on some team.
Now imagine the league games were nationally televised Pick Sixes involving the six highest quality races of the day with large fields among all active tracks. Wouldn’t that be an effective recruiting tool for the industry?
22 Dec 2012 at 06:19 am | #
NYRA’s rule shows how clueless and inept they are which is shocking because you’d think NY would produce shaper minded people making these kind of decisions.If the game is well regulated....what are they afraid of? The STEWARDS aren’t allowed to bet and that’s understandable but everyone else connected to the game/sport should be welcomed at any window in my opinion.
The Player Pools/P-6 future....I come from an entire different perspective. I think the future should be teaching new customers:
1-reading Racing Form or other publications to form a somewhat educated opinion on the upcoing race.
2- tracks should invest some marketing dollars and contract a player like Barry Meadows to publish a 20 page pamphlet on Money Management to enlighten all players on the importance of money management.
P-6 play today is basically So Cal tracks,NY tracks and Churchill Downs for their 2 big days in May.
The P-6 is a HUGE mathematical advantage to big bettors and pool players that can afford as many selections as possible within the 6 races. The high-end customers more than likely win 80% of P-6 tickets...not necessarily because they are great handicappers rather they played the right races where they could afford to to have 4-8 selections in a maiden race of some kind.For instance, Del Mar’s 37 day meet last summer. I believe they had nearly half of the days as Carryovers with over 35% of the P-6 races were Maiden races of some sort.Personally, I pass on the “unlimited cost” freedom allowed with P-6 tickets.
I will resume playing a multi 6 race exotic when an A type track offers an alternative for the small -mid sized exotic player.I’ve proposed over the years an exotic bet called HIT - 64 which has a $1 minimum BUT a $64 maximum attached to each ticket.This seems fair to all and when anyone wins the HIT - 64....everyone will know the winning ticket(s)cost less than $65 which is news in itself. The detractors will say....a big bettor can bet 20 $64 tickets. My response...good luck but the fact remains....winning ticket(s) didn’t exceed $64 cost.I’d like to bring back REWARDING sharp handicapping at minimal investment....that’s a heckava lot more appealing than a news report of someone winning a $200,000 P-6 on a $4,200 ticket.